Former Minister of Petroleum and Energy, and Mines, Power and Steel, Tam David-West, in an exclusive interview with GBENRO ADESINA, vowed to join Nigerians in crucifying the president-elect, General Muhammadu Buhari, if he fails the nation

What is your view about the wind of change blowing and the emergence of your former boss and friend as the president-elect?

I can’t find adequate words to describe my happiness. I feel like jumping out of my skin for joy. I am so happy for Nigerians, the president-elect, General Muhamadu Buhari and Tam David-West. I know that the change will come. I have confidence in Buhari. I am aware that the expectations of Nigerians are justifiably and reasonably high. Buhari’s victory is a God given victory and I know God will give him all it takes to succeed in office. He has been cheated three times. Buhari challenged the victory of the former president, late Umaru Yar’Adua at the 2007 presidential election in the court. Seven members that heard the case split into two: three for Buhari and four for Yar’Adua. So, Yar’Adua defeated Buhari by one vote. After the court decision, I wrote an article saying that Buhari is a moral president of Nigeria while Yar’Adua is a legal president. At this stage, Nigerians should know that Buhari is not a magician. We should not expect any miracle or magic from him. We should give him time. Under him, Nigeria will move forward. Light will improve. Corruption will be destroyed. Nigerians will naturally follow a good leader that is disciplined, and not corrupt and help him. But Nigerians are very interesting people. If Nigerians believe that a leader is corrupt, they will help him to be corrupt and if they know that you hate corruption, they will help you to fight it. Nigerians should turn themselves to intelligence and help Buhari to fish out corrupt leaders.

•David West

In the last one month, President Jonathan has been firing and hiring people especially in the key establishments of government when his tenure is about to expire. What do you feel about this?

Jonathan as a PhD holder should be more intelligent than he is. He should know the essentials of governance. First, Jonathan should know that there are certain things a responsible government shouldn’t do at the 11th hour like making major changes when you are about to leave. Though, government is a continuum but if a new government does not like what it meets, it will change it constitutionally so as not to start on a bad footing. Jonathan should not think of frustrating the in-coming government by his recklessness. I consider appointments into sensitive places, and firing people as reckless because you know that they don’t stand the chance of longetivity. His actions are suspicious.

Nigerians see Buhari as the last hope, what can he do to start putting things right immediately he is sworn-in?

First, I am sure that Buhari will not see himself as the last hope of Nigeria. He is one of the shinning hopes. In the newspapers, I have read lots of advice to the president-elect on things to be done. They are good because they all fall within the blueprint of Buhari which he has developed for a long time. Buhari’s agenda is masses oriented. The only person I have issue with among those that are giving the advice is Jonathan’s Finance Minister, Ngozi Okonjo-Iweala who said that Nigeria is the biggest economy in Africa. This is a mere statistical juggling because there is nothing on ground to justify this. She sometimes creates the impression that the economy is buoyant. Recently, she announced that government will borrow N473b to pay salary. Government ministries and some states can’t pay salaries and owing some months and Iweala is saying that the economy is buoyant. The incoming government should start from the premises that Nigeria is broke and not rely on Iweala’s curious figures.

As a former minister of petroleum, what agenda will you set for the new government on how to start fixing the oil sector?

For obvious reason, I will not talk on NNPC now. I have said a lot about NNPC, that it is corrupt. I have talked about refinery. There are lots of things to be done. But we need to do better. Oil is the life of Nigerians. It makes over 80 percent of our annual budget. Over 90 percent of our foreign money is from oil. Oil is very important to us. Oil belongs to Nigeria. My fellow compatriots from Niger Delta who call themselves militants are threatening to burst oil pipelines if the incoming administration does not play ball according to their rules. That is myopic because if you make oil difficult to operate, oil companies will leave us. Shell operates all over the world. If Shell pulls out, who will suffer? Nigerians and we from that area will suffer more. I know if you toy with oil industry in Nigeria, you will kill Nigeria. Sometime ago, Buhari signed a decree that every bunker must face capital punishment and I told my brothers in the Niger Delta, some of who brag that they are bunkers, to note that the law has not changed because if you are a bunkered and you are caught, the law says you must be executed.

But that is a decree. Are you saying that it will be imported into our constitution?

Constitution is the fundamental document of the country but a lot of things are done for the day today running of the ministry that it doesn’t have to be in the constitution. I have a letter from world bodies like Amnesty International saying please don’t allow the president to sign this into law. I replied them that I support it. Why? I said oil is the life of Nigeria and a man that want Nigeria to die is not worth to live.

Are you advocating that economic saboteurs should face capital punishment?

Absolutely yes. Also, election riggers should face capital punishment. If armed robbers who inflict pain on the family of their victims face capital punishment, why will election riggers who inflict pains on the whole federation should not be killed?

How do you think that Buhari can be assessed after his four years?

No government does nothing and no government does everything. His government should be judged by its commitment to change, sincerity and programme for change. So, Buhari should be judged; first, take corruption, is he corrupt? Did he lead by example? I am sure he is going to lead by example, but if not, I will join Nigerians to crucify him. Let me tell you a story to buttress how shrewd Buhari is in leading by example. A senior military officer told me that his younger brother who was in a tertiary institution sent him a letter containing list of things he wanted. Buhari invited him to Dodan Barracks and he was very happy that he would get a windfall. When he arrived, Buhari asked him to read the letter and he obliged. He asked him how much will his request cost and he mentioned several thousands. Buhari asked his brother, “Do you know my salary as head of state?” And he ordered that they should take him out and trash him. The boy was well flogged. After that, he gave him what he had.

I am worried about those that are close to Buhari. If you think that you will be given special treatment because you are close to him, you are wasting your time because he will use you to set example of his strictness. There was a day I went to brief him. He asked me, “Prof, what do you want?” And I replied Fanta. He asked the steward to get it for me. The steward came back to say there was no Fanta and Buhari said, “Prof, there is no Fanta in Dodan Barracks”. After the brief, I left without drinking the Fanta. For discipline, corruption, leadership by example, focus, he will be scored A plus. Saboteurs should be careful because he will not compromise in fighting them to a standstill. He will not tolerate people slowing him down. In every aspect of economy, we are going to find positive difference. His assessment should start from six months. Nigerians will find positive visible change in all aspects. To make impact with our refineries will be few months. We can build a refinery in a year.

•One of the refineries in Port Harcourt

What is your take on declaration of assets because some political office holders don’t believe in it?

I declared my assets three times without anybody asking me to do so. Any public officer that refuses to declare his assets is a crook, a thief and armed and pen robber.

With your age, do you think that you have the energy to function effectively in government?

God is ageless, timeless and omnipotent. If God gives you public assignment in spite of your age, He will give you the energy to do it. The Prime Minister of Tunisia is over 90 years, and he defeated a younger candidate, who is about 68, in an election. He is still alert. It is not the calendar number. Is the person alert mentally and energetic? For example, few years ago, I joined Academic Staff Union of Universities, ASUU, to walk round Ibadan in protesting against fuel subsidy removal. In fact, one needs more energy now because things are so bad compared to when we left it. Buhari is not starting from zero but below zero.

In the early 70s, oil was not the main thing we relied on. Now we rely on oil and its price has fallen badly. What else can we do to have strong economic base?

I know Buhari knows what to be done and he will do them. Agriculture and mining are important, providing enabling environment to companies and businesses to triumph. We must be prudent.

What is your stake on the report of Price Water House on NNPC?

It is quite revealing and its recommendations should be fully implemented but Buhari needs to re-audit the commission because thorough auditing of NNPC is yet to be done. Jonathan administration didn’t provide all the necessary documents needed for the auditing. They audited only the papers that were given to them. $20b is a lot of money. It is a budget of about five states in Nigeria. Sanusi, the former governor of CBN suffered because of this thing. Not only that Jonathan removed him as CBN governor, he was so vindictive and petty that he congratulated a wrong person when Sanusi was made the Emir of Kano. To clear issues, Sanusi never said that the $20b was missing. He said that $20b accrued to the federation account was not there. Now he has been vindicated. The minister of petroleum said that $20b was not missing but it was charged to certain items on PIB bill. Why should the minister charge money to a section of a bill that has not been passed into law. That action was very unlawful, careless and reckless. Sanusi was right. Every penny goes to federation account for it to be shared among the states and Federal Government. If you take money that is meant for federation account for other items, then you are punishing the states.

How do you see the current hike in petroleum price in Nigeria?

To sell fuel above the official price of N87 is criminal and any government that allows that is a criminal. It is even worse that NNPC mega stations that are supposed to sell at a control price have joined the bandwagon. All these madness will soon stop because Buhari has promised to build four refineries and repair the old ones that are repairable. With that there will be no more fuel importation and the price will come down.

On a lighter note, one would have expected you to have your house in choice area in Ibadan rather than this area considered a slum mostly inhabited by poor people, how comfortable are you here?

I am very comfortable especially with my neigbours. My maternal grandfather inculcated great virtues in me. He was very wealthy but usually tells me that I was not different from any other children. Every three months, my grandfather made a banquet for the chiefs and immediately after that he made for all the children from poor family and we eat together. He always says that God did not create us better than children from poor background and that we are just fortunate to be his children. I am more comfortable with ordinary people than the privileged people. If you want to see the true state of Nigeria, come to a place like this or go to the villages not among the professors and privileged ones, they are fake Nigerians and faulty image of Nigeria. God loves poor people so much that he created more poor people than rich people. When I came here, the road was so bad, the place was so bushy and unkempt but I was attracted because it was so quiet and I can retire here.

Are you not disturbed by the noise from churches around you?

There are two churches at my backyard here. Every day, they drum, sing and pray aloud which I am not used to. God is not deaf. You don’t have to shout for him to hear. I have adjusted myself to it. What I do is that whenever they are doing that, I join them in spirit in my room.

The road leading to your house is not motorable, what are you and other community members doing to uplift the area?

I give credit to Otunba Adebayo Alao-Akala, former governor of Oyo State. I will not forget him for giving me audience without booking appointment when I went to discuss this area with him. Without wasting time, he sent his officials to inspect this place and eventually approved the road to be tarred and a transformer for us. Right now, this area is having problem with Ibadan Electricity Distribution Company, IBDC denying us electricity for over three weeks.

What happened?

In their wickedness, IBDC relocated my area from a feeder to a poor feeder and ever since, the community has not been having light. I feel very aggrieved about this because the act is very mischievous. I am sorry for the whole neigbourhood. What IBDC has done is fraudulent. I am only restraining myself, if not I would have gone to IBDC office to ask why my neigbourhood is being denied electricity. I pray that they should connect this area back to the former feeder else….

Since the electricity company in Nigeria was privatized, the situation has worsened, people are no longer enjoying electricity as it used to be, meters are not supplied after they have been paid for and people are crazily billed. What do you think the incoming administration should do to correct all these anomalies in the power sector?

General Buhari himself has assured Nigerians that power is a priority to him because everything including development and industry depend on it. Getting it right will reduce unemployment, prices of commodities will fall. I remember that the MD of Cadbury once said that his company is permanently on generator. He said they generate electricity 24 hours and that they don’t depend on NEPA. He said if their product is on the assembly line and power fails for one minute, all that line will be destroyed and they can’t risk that. The cost is put on their products for people to pay. Privatization is good but I don’t believe it is a panacea. Egbin power station was commissioned during my time as the Minister of Power. Engineer Tuko, was the MD of NEPA. We worked so well. Every month, all the MD/GM of parastatals under me will attend strategic committee meetings with my permanent secretary and tell him their problems. Every three months, I presided over the strategic committee meetings. At the meetings, they tell us their problems and resolve them very quickly and things were moving very well.

Would you suggest that government should take back electricity?

Government ownership doesn’t need to be a failure per se. It can be very effective if efficiently managed. I don’t believe that private companies should be more efficient than government companies. With right management, commitment, good leadership and absence of corruption, government agencies would do well. One day, I was with Air Vice Marshal Alfa on Victoria Island and light went off, and I said don’t worry, light will soon come. Not long after I said so, Engineer Tuko, NEPA MD phoned me and said that he was already at the station resolving the problem and within 15 minutes, light was back. On estimated bills, we need to know that it is not only NNPC that is corrupt, NEPA too is very corrupt. The in-coming administration should ensure that electricity companies provide meters, possibly free of charge, to their customers. Estimated bill is fraudulent and wicked.